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Old 04-27-2009   #61
90 L98 TransAm
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Re: Vortech Supercharger

Gave up on using the small windshield washer fluid reservoir that comes with the Vortech kit. didn't want to cut and splice the washer pump wiring and would have had to have used longer washer hose re-routed to the passenger side next to relocated battery.

So I put togther this even smaller ghetto reservoir and stuck the factory washer pump in the side of it at the bottom. It's just forward of the relocated cruise control servo where the factory put the battery. Should get me through the safety inspection (if it doesn't melt first):


http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s...e/100_1446.jpg


Lesson Learned: Found out from ThirdGen that the cruise control vacuum line is not a usable source of vacuum for an SC boost gauge/FMU/Ignition Retarder due to the check valve in the line from the intake manifold. So I put the cruise control vacuum lines back to original configuration. Replaced the 5-port vacuum fitting I was using for gauge/FMU/Ignition Retard with a 4-port fitting to clean things up and avoid using vacuum caps. Teed into the intake manifold vacuum line upstream from the check valve and ran the line to the 4-port fitting near the FMU and air filter.

Took her out for another test drive and my gauge says I'm getting up to 9 psi of boost!

Feels like a whole new car. Will set up my Passport GT-2 performance meter for my car and get some ballpark numbers.
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Vortech V-3 SC, 11+ psi boost
0 - 60 in 5.40 Seconds
1/4 mile in 13.9 seconds @ 103 mph @ 5,000' elevation, 309 HP (per Escort GT-2 meter)
Shift kit, 9 clutch 3/4, Corvette servo
Magnaflow 16829 catback exhaust
TDS fr. sway bar bushings and end links. Wonderbar
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Old 05-16-2009   #62
90 L98 TransAm
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Re: Vortech Supercharger

Finally got some numbers using my Passport performance meter.

Did a few 0-60 mph runs with a best of 5.40 seconds and indicated max 287 HP at the engine.


Results from my only 1/4 mile run so far were:

0-60 mph again in 5.40 seconds
1/4 mile in 13.90 seconds @ 103 mph
indicated max 309 HP

This was at 5,000' elevation.
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Vortech V-3 SC, 11+ psi boost
0 - 60 in 5.40 Seconds
1/4 mile in 13.9 seconds @ 103 mph @ 5,000' elevation, 309 HP (per Escort GT-2 meter)
Shift kit, 9 clutch 3/4, Corvette servo
Magnaflow 16829 catback exhaust
TDS fr. sway bar bushings and end links. Wonderbar
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Old 06-07-2009   #63
Tony89GTA
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Re: Vortech Supercharger

Not bad time for that altitude, your 0-60's could use some work

I'am curious about your boost at different rpm lvl's, what you making at

3500 RPM
4000 RPM
4500 RPM
5000 RPM
5500 RPM
6000 RPM
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ATI Procharger D1SC, AFR 195 Eliminator heads, Mini Ram, ZZ9 cam, AS&M Mono-blade TB, 60Ibs injectors, Stainless Works LT 1 3/4 headers, Mufflex 4" catback with Magnaflow race muffler, McLeod Street twin clutch, Moser Ford 9" with 3.70, DIY Prom with Code59. Stock short block

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Old 06-07-2009   #64
90 L98 TransAm
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Re: Vortech Supercharger

I'm no drag racer that's for sure! Got some tips from Cliff on how to launch the next time though.

Unfortunately, i don't have a data logger so i can't provide any accurate boost vs. rpm info.

Care to guess what kind of numbers an experienced/skilled driver could get with my current setup (preferably without breaking something)?

How about with some mods like yours (nice car by the way) starting with a better exhaust system?
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Vortech V-3 SC, 11+ psi boost
0 - 60 in 5.40 Seconds
1/4 mile in 13.9 seconds @ 103 mph @ 5,000' elevation, 309 HP (per Escort GT-2 meter)
Shift kit, 9 clutch 3/4, Corvette servo
Magnaflow 16829 catback exhaust
TDS fr. sway bar bushings and end links. Wonderbar
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Old 06-09-2009   #65
Tony89GTA
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Re: Vortech Supercharger

Is your car stock at the moment with just the blower on?

Also what's your goal with the car?
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89 T-Top GTA 5.7L T-56
ATI Procharger D1SC, AFR 195 Eliminator heads, Mini Ram, ZZ9 cam, AS&M Mono-blade TB, 60Ibs injectors, Stainless Works LT 1 3/4 headers, Mufflex 4" catback with Magnaflow race muffler, McLeod Street twin clutch, Moser Ford 9" with 3.70, DIY Prom with Code59. Stock short block

http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2480939
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Old 06-09-2009   #66
90 L98 TransAm
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Re: Vortech Supercharger

Yes Tony, it was bone stock other than a throttle body airfoil and a K&N filter.

The Vortech manual says the engine must have stock compression (then it says to check with them prior to use of their SC kit if it has been modified in any way).

I was getting bored with the stock performance and had only driven the car 500 miles/yr the past couple of years. Almost bought a low mile TTA but now i'm glad i didn't as i would have been afraid to drive it much due to collector car value. Also, i wouldn't have been able to sell mine for what i think it's worth. It's getting pretty bad when a new Nissan sedan has more power than these cars had from the factory. And new WRXs get to 60 mph in under 5 seconds with no mods!

Anyway, at this point i'm more curious about performance gains from various mods as i don't plan to spend any more $ on the car this year. Also I expect emissions testing to start here within the next two or three years so will need to be able to pass the inspection. Further down the road i will be moving and shouldn't have to worry about the tests.

What sequence did you follow when you modded your car and what kind of gains did you get for each change?
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Vortech V-3 SC, 11+ psi boost
0 - 60 in 5.40 Seconds
1/4 mile in 13.9 seconds @ 103 mph @ 5,000' elevation, 309 HP (per Escort GT-2 meter)
Shift kit, 9 clutch 3/4, Corvette servo
Magnaflow 16829 catback exhaust
TDS fr. sway bar bushings and end links. Wonderbar
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Old 06-10-2009   #67
Tony89GTA
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Re: Vortech Supercharger

When I first started to mod I did most of the basic bolt on stuff then added the blower. Your best bet right now would be a full exhaust for the car that should help it out a lot especially now with the blower on. If your going to keep it the same and not go to crazy with engine mods down the road, look into getting Dyno Don's headers, they are a shorty type header and probably the best you can get of that type. Get him to make it so the y-pipe is 3 1/2" then pick up a mufflex catback thats 3 1/2" to match. This should really help your car out.

If you look over on thirdgen.org and look up Dynodon and send him a pm it's the best way to get in contact with him all though sometimes he can be hard to get ahold of.

I also found when I installed my intake system it did gave me a boost in seat of the pants performance, I installed it after the blower was on. Might be something down the road to consider but for now go for the exhaust cause it will be your biggest gain.
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Old 06-23-2009   #68
gzipin
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Re: Vortech Supercharger

Just curious........Did you evaluate your horsepower rating on dyno prior to the supercharger install? Do you plan to after install is complete. I'm just curious as to exactly how much more horsepower you gain from all this work and expense. I have been considering installing supercharger for many years but haven't had the time and skeptical as to whether it's worth all the work.
Jerry
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Old 06-23-2009   #69
90 L98 TransAm
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Re: Vortech Supercharger

No, I haven't had my car on a dyno. Didn't even get any baseline numbers with my performance meter since I began the install in January and the roads aren't clear here until late Spring. About all I can say is that the indicated engine HP on my only 1/4 mile run was about 65 HP greater than the factory rating. That number would increase with a better launch. Also the 0-60 times for the stock cars were mid 6's and 1/4 mile times were high 14s. Those times would have been slower at my elevation (5,000') so i think i've probably improved my 0-60 and 1/4 mile times by nearly 1.5 seconds. And this is with all the emissions equipment intact.

Here is what Vortech says for the standard '88 - '92 F-body kit with a V-2 supercharger:

This Vortech supercharging system can safely increase the TPI's horsepower from 245 to 340 and torque from 345 lb./ft. to 430 lb./ft.*

They also say:

*Supercharged horsepower and torque data shown is a calculated estimate based on percentage increases from actual rear wheel hp/tq measurements.


The max boost for the kit with a V-2 supercharger is listed as 8 psig. I have been hitting 10-11 psig peak boost with my V-3 so I need to install a bypass valve.

I would like to do some more standard mods and take the car to a tuner with a dyno in the future but probably not this year.

Maybe Tony or some other members can provide some baseline power and torque info for our cars (and gains from various mods too).
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Vortech V-3 SC, 11+ psi boost
0 - 60 in 5.40 Seconds
1/4 mile in 13.9 seconds @ 103 mph @ 5,000' elevation, 309 HP (per Escort GT-2 meter)
Shift kit, 9 clutch 3/4, Corvette servo
Magnaflow 16829 catback exhaust
TDS fr. sway bar bushings and end links. Wonderbar
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Old 06-24-2009   #70
merc3065
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Re: Vortech Supercharger

read this article, it answers a lot about boost...http://www.gmhightechperformance.com...est/index.html
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Old 07-06-2010   #71
90 L98 TransAm
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Re: Vortech Supercharger

I was getting too much boost (up to 11.5 psi) from my V-3 supercharger even after twice increasing supercharger pulley size.

Don't want to blow a head gasket or damage the stock engine so I just installed a Bosch bypass valve:

bypass.jpg


I drilled the SC output plenum and plastic 90 degree SC input elbow with a 59/64" bit and tapped them with 3/4"-14 NPT pipe tap. The vacuum line on the right side of the valve tees into the same manifold pressure line my boost gauge and fuel management unit are connected to.

Here's a shot of the bypass valve input coming off the bottom of the SC discharge plenum:

scdischarge.jpg


Did a few test runs and my boost now seems to be limited to a safe(r) 6.5 psi or so. Will have lost some performance but at least now I can floor it without (as much) fear of doing damage. Hopefully installing my Magnaflow catback will at least partially offset the losses.

Last edited by 90 L98 TransAm; 07-06-2010 at 05:29 PM.
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Old 07-07-2010   #72
Tony89GTA
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Re: Vortech Supercharger

Not sure how adding a bypass valve stoped it from seeing 11.5 psi it's ment to release the pressure after you close your throttle, guess you must be talking about a spike in pressure, looks nice though. BTW I was up to 18 PSI on the stock block I'am sure the 11 psi wont hurt it, it's all in the tune really. How are you tunning the thing, with a FMU or with burning chips?
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89 T-Top GTA 5.7L T-56
ATI Procharger D1SC, AFR 195 Eliminator heads, Mini Ram, ZZ9 cam, AS&M Mono-blade TB, 60Ibs injectors, Stainless Works LT 1 3/4 headers, Mufflex 4" catback with Magnaflow race muffler, McLeod Street twin clutch, Moser Ford 9" with 3.70, DIY Prom with Code59. Stock short block

http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2480939
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Old 07-07-2010   #73
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GTA Year: 1988
GTA Engine: 350 TPI Automatic
Re: Vortech Supercharger

Im looking for one of these for my car. Was gonna do it next year with my tax return money but I got a good deal on a Harley so Im buying the bike. I will be doing it to my GTA soon, very soon LOL.
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Old 07-07-2010   #74
90 L98 TransAm
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Re: Vortech Supercharger

Very glad to hear your car was taking that much boost with no apparent damage Tony. Maybe I've been worrying too much for nothing.

I think the original Vortech SC System for '88 - '92 GM 5.0 and 5.7 TPI F-Bodies was supposed to put out 6-8 psi using engine-oil-lubricated V-1 or V-2 head units. I didn't want to punch a hole in my oil pan (read a nightmare thread where one of the SC oil lines failed and the engine and SC were both toast) so the vendor substituted a self-lubricated V-3 in my system.

The system includes a Fuel Management Unit and an MSD Boost Timing Master (shown earlier in this thread) and that's all i'm using at this point.

I've read that bypass valves are recommended for boost levels over 8 psi or so and that they prevent compressor surge. Somewhere along the line I got the notion that they also limit max boost (thus protecting your engine) but am now learning that that is not the case. I increased the SC pulley size twice but the boost was still higher than what I thought were safe levels (~8 psi) the F-body kit was supposed to produce. Thought maybe the V-3 was a lot more efficient than the V-1 or V-2.

The Bosch bypass valve didn't come with any install instructions so I searched on the internet. I found an Audi site and installed mine the way they had. Test drove and saw that it wasn't limiting my boost (as I had incorrectly expected) so got back on the net and searched some more. Found an SC forum post by a vendor tech that said to install it just the opposite orientation from the Audi site. Then looked at the Vortech SC install guide for a Ford Cobra which also shows the opposite installation compared to the Audi site. I then reversed my valve and saw peak boost of 6.5 psi on my initial test drives. By the way, the Ford Cobra system uses the exact same Bosch valve I installed and that system is supposed to produce 11 psi.

The SC vendor tech tells me that if installing a bypass valve is now limiting my boost that I may need to upgrade to a "bigger" or "stronger" valve. I will drive the car to work for a few weeks and observe the boost and how the car runs.

What is your personal experience with bypass valves?

I enjoy the occaisonal posts on tuning by Merc, perhaps yourself, and others. Not sure if GTA Source Page is the proper place for it but a thread on the basics of tuning, burning chips, etc. would be great.
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Old 07-08-2010   #75
Tony89GTA
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Re: Vortech Supercharger

I use the procharger bypass valve, basically it's just a butterfly type valve controlled by vacuum, seems to work alright.

For yourself if your car is working alright I would invest into a WOB2 meter and see how it's doing and if it's running good maybe just leave it alone since your pretty much stock as is.

I'll admit getting into computer tunning is kind of a pain in the ass and takes awile to setup and understand whats going on, but once you get that figured out is very rewarding to be programing your car yourself. There is a few starter threads over on thirdgen.org that will get you going but think they need a update since craig moates has made things lot easier with his autoprom and or ostrich plus memcal adapters. I still consider myself a beginner really but I know enough to make things run pretty good. If your really interested in it ill run you through what you need to get started.
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Old 07-08-2010   #76
90 L98 TransAm
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Re: Vortech Supercharger

Well, I got almost 10 psi boost this morning with no changes (oh the joys of working in the desert!) and the car ran well so I'll leave it be for now.

Thanks for the offer. i'll start by checking out the TGO threads and look into the products you mentioned.
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Old 07-08-2010   #77
Tony89GTA
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Re: Vortech Supercharger

My current computer tooning hardware and software include;

This is the memcal adapter, you plug in your stock memcal into this and this is where you put your new burnt chips into or the autoprom emulation cable.
http://www.moates.net/product_info.p...products_id=41

This is the autoprom, does your chip burning/reading, datalogging or realtime emulation if you want it. It's a pretty kick ass product!
http://www.moates.net/product_info.p...products_id=54

There is also the ostrich to you can look at but think you need something separate for the datalogging for it and it don't do chip burning/reading.
http://www.moates.net/product_info.p...roducts_id=169

TunerPro RT is the main program to use for the actual tunning of your car plus you use it for emulation with your autoprom or ostrich. It's a free program but if you buy the autoprom it will give you the software license to get rid of the nag screen on startup.
http://www.tunerpro.net/
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