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Old 05-09-2002   #21
Red88GTA
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Another clarification on the fuel pump running. There is a switch located just above the oil filter going into the side of the block. Once the car runs and shows oil pressure, this switch energizes the fuel pump to continue pumping. I broke this switch one time and it does kill the car though it would at least try to start. Are you sure the timing chain hasn't jumped or the distributor itself jumped out of time. I realize you are getting spark so it is actually turning. You have fuel at the injectors, as long as their is some kind of pressure at all, it would be enough to make the car do something. I am seriously wondering if the timing isn't far off..??!! Don't worry about the fuel pump if you can push the shrader (sp) valve and fuel sprays out. (if it just oozes out, well that's a whole different story.)

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Old 05-09-2002   #22
gtayumiko
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Hello Everyone,

Red88GTA, I just purchasing from GM that part you speak about comming out of engine block right above oil filter. From what they tell me, this sensor is an automatic shutoff sensor. It detects if the car has rolled over and will turn off the fuel pump in that situation. I knew someone who's car broken down just like f-crazy's GTA. But it was his timing chain broken. Has f-crazy actually check to see if distributor is turning when he is trying to start engine? Distributor is connect to cam and cam connect to crank via timing chair, yes? Yumiko
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Old 05-09-2002   #23
f-crazy
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thats the other thing that i have doubts about.....it would take 5 disabled injectors for it to stop running and i really doubt 5 went out at one time....so im thinking its a computer problem or a very weak fuel pump...i tried to rent one from autozone and i walked 2 miles for them to tell me thats its only for a mechanical pump...
when it has pressure in the lines it sprays pretty good but when i try to start it it barely comes out...ill try the computer tomorrow and let you guys know

has n e one or knows someone thats changed the pump from above....
cut a square and fold it back to where it goes down, change the pump fold the metal back down....peen both sides...arc it back together
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Old 05-09-2002   #24
gtayumiko
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Cutting a hole in car to get to pump. I thought about that before myself. However, I think you have to take out tank before you tearing hole in car. Because you need to know exactly where to cut and hose assemblies coming out of tank are one piece very big and you will have to cut big enough hole so everything will come out in one piece. Plus, tank and hoses assemblies are so close to frame of car, you would probably cut into tank and hoses if you didn't remove these things from car first. At this point, best result from cutting into car would be for the next time you need to change pump. This time you need to take out tank before cutting. Yumiko
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Old 05-10-2002   #25
f-crazy
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update..

my car has oil pressure so i dont htink the switch is bad...today i used some gas ina sprayer and sprayed it into the throttle body and it came right to life...it would keep running as long as i kept spraying the gas...and it wasnt running rough..the rpms jumped because when i sprayed the gas they got higher wheen it was alomst out it got slower....is there n e thing it could possibly be othere then the fuel pump....like i said it has oil pressure...
if the switch is bad then it doesnt matter if i have oil pressure but when i opend the schrader valve the other day with the lines pressurized it sprayed out but when i tried to start it it was about 2/3's less pressure...i should have this switch tested im gonna call autozone right now brb
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Old 05-10-2002   #26
Red88GTA
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That information you said just concludes what the problem is. Fuel Pump or Fuel pump relay and etc.

Gtayumiko. Take a look at that switch when you get it. You will notice that it go into the oil gallery. In fact, the name of the switch is called a "Oil Pressure/Fuel Cut-off" switch.
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Old 05-10-2002   #27
Brent87LT1
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Seriously doubt it's the FP relay, or else it would never come on. It's probably the fuel pump. Change it by dropping the tank! I knew a guy that cut a hole. By the time he was done cutting a little more and a little more, to get the unit out, I could have dropped the tank and done it right without cutting the car up.
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Old 05-12-2002   #28
f-crazy
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beleive me if i had the resources to do it the right way i would....bvut like i said my exhaust is welded together so i cant disconnect it...i dont have jack stands so i can drop the shocks and panhard bar..and i dont have the cash to fork over 300 bucks in labor....i already checked its so much because the exhaust is welded together...my friends brother has done it this way on his 90 iroc so hes gonna give a hand...i really dont want to cut it up but my freind is a body man and his brother showed me what it looked like when he was done and welded up....and if he wouldnt of pointed it out i wouldnt of noticed...
so like u guys said i think its the fuel pump...im gonna do it tomorrow...i wish i could do it the correct way but sometimes you can wish right...ill keep you guys posted...
later guys
"crazy"
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Old 05-14-2002   #29
f-crazy
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Unhappy update

i changed the pump today and it still will not start...it only will when i spray in the tb....
im gonna keep it short cuz im so goddamn pissed off

anyone wanna buy a red 91 with a 5-speed and t-tops
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Old 05-15-2002   #30
f-crazy
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yesterday when my buddy tried to start it i stood behind the car and i seen black smoke comeing out the tail pipes so i know it is getting fuel..... but does it take more spark to start it then to run it and what else can it be i am pulling my hair out....i dropped it off to get it diagnosed well pushed it lol he tried to tell me that it was the cap rotor and control modual i told him it has spark cause it runs..... later dudes
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Old 05-19-2002   #31
f-crazy
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update

well there was no fuel pressure because the pulsator came off the pump...i put it back on and still nothing...theres pressure at the rails but theres no fuel gettin into the motor...could the regulator be bad?... but if it was bad wouldnt the car still atleast choke?....how much are ohmmeters? i need to check the injectors for a pulse...how much would a computer be?? i dont think it has the original computer in it because the sticker say "remanufactured" on it....could there be n e other thing that wouldnt allow fuel to get into the motor?
one other thing...does it take more spark to start the car then to run it??...because it runs when i spray fuel into it so i know its atleast putting spark out..the control module is good so could the cap n rotor be bad? but even then the car would run crappy....the computer is still sending out a spark signal but maybe not for the injectors?...im sure a computer would be cheaper then a set of injectors and it would be alot easier to replace...i appoligize for the dozen questions but its been a month this problem has been aggravating me and i would really like to drive my ride...please guys let me know n e thing
"crazy"
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Old 05-20-2002   #32
f-crazy
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yesterday i checked the injector pulse there was none so today i got a new computer and it still wont run....i cranked it and there was no oil pressure but there is when i spray fuel into it and run it
i didnt change the fuel pressur eregulator or the oil pressure switch because there was no injector pulse..will the oil pressure switch keep it from running?.....
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Old 05-20-2002   #33
Red88GTA
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That oil pressure/fuel cutoff switch may keep it from running but not from starting since you don't have pressure when cranking. You need to get back to basics on the fuel pump or an obstructions of some sort.
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Old 05-22-2002   #34
f-crazy
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update

the computer was bad so i replaced it...today when i cranked it there was 45 psi of oil pressure so its got oil pressure and i know the switch is good because when i crank it i hear the pump come on so the switch is allowing the pump to run....i got the fuel regulator today and im gonna put it on in the morning...i took my map sensor to get tested but they didnt have the equipment to test it....so i went with the fuel related part...
you guys never answerd my question about it taking more spark to start then to run it....one guy told me no the other told me yes...
and when my buddy cranks it i stand behind the car and see black smoke puffin out the tailpipes...so its getting fuel just not firing...were does the fuel enter the rails? does it go through the regualtor first??...i dunno if its not this or the map sensor i think im gonna get it outta my hair....
a 50 dollar tps took 300 bucks worth of parts with it....*shakes head*

i know this post has been goin on for awhile and im sure yall are tired of it and beleive me so am i...so lets get this over with huh...
the guy at autozone told me that i had all the guys there mind boggled and a mechanic i talked to told me the same thing ive gone through (cap rotor and control module) and i told him that he was wrong and went down the list of what ive done and he offered me a job lol...i start there next week...
let me know n e thing even if its an "i dont know"
"crazy"
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Old 05-22-2002   #35
gtayumiko
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Unhappy

I personally hoping that you find out what ever this problem is soon as possible. Even it is not my car but I still feel so much frustrations because of this. I should be not let this bother me because it not my car and.....I am sending this reply from ship in middle of Pacific Ocean....I am on cruising ship Anyway, I just hoping you can solve this problem because you should be enjoying GTA instead of fixing. Yumiko
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Old 05-23-2002   #36
f-crazy
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Angry shafted

well my problem went from bad to worse to im phucked...i took off the plenum off to get to the regulator to find out that 2 bolts were stripped...i guess someone didnt relize they were "tamper resistant" screws.. like i said i got 4 off but the other 2 are still there laughing at me...how the hell do i get them out...i was thinking about cutting the tops off them and sealing it another way witht he 4 i got out...i really dont want to tap them but if theres no other way i guess i have to....i tried to take the whole regulator assembly off to have a little more room to figure out what im gonna do but i cant get that off either....like yumiko said gta's are meant to be driven and enjoyed not be pushed from one side of the street to the other...damn this sucks...
i lost my job today because of this crap so i went from having little cash to fix it to payin with pocket lint...how much are fuel rails in case i sell my ass lol j/k but really how much are they in case i bend/break them.....im very frustrated almost to the point were i wanna hang a for sale sign in the window...im gonna look at lt1's tomorrow
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Old 05-23-2002   #37
ottawagta
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Try taking the stripped bolts out with small vise-grips.
Replace 'em all with some nice stainless steel ones.
You don't need to remove the regulator body, just put a new diaghram and spring kit in it. (Holley makes a nice adjustable set-up)($200 CDN).

-Eric
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Old 05-23-2002   #38
f-crazy
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i tried to use vise grips but they just spun around the screws..the other 4 are fine its just the 2 that are fubar....i think im gonna try to bend up the collar a little and snap the screws off..i know i can bend the collar back to form but if theres 2 screws missing maybe i can seal it with something....n e response will be appreciated thank guys and yumiko lol
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Old 05-23-2002   #39
ottawagta
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Can you use a dremel and cut a slot on top of the screws so you can use a flat head screwdriver? Or dremel the sides of the screw to let the vise grips grip better?

I'd worry about not having screws all the way around, It might be sealed for a while and then one day a leak and a nice gas shower under the hood.....

-Eric
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Old 05-23-2002   #40
f-crazy
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i have a dremel but i broke my last cutoff wheel the other day...if i can get the other 2 off ill get a new set from the dealer...
ill try both things u suggested...first the slot for the screwdriver if that doesnt work then i hack up the edges so i grip them with a pliers of vise grip
ill keep you guys posted
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