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Old 08-10-2007   #61
FearThisGTA
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GTA Year: 1991
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Re: Take a look at this hack job...

Unfortunately, the clones are out there and there's a heap of them. ANd some are real good, so good, that unless you are a traid expert and just know that car make and model extensively or a trained professional then you cant tell.
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1991 GTA Trans Am
w/305,231 miles
on the original motor!!!!
Time of Death on motor, 4:07pm on 05/29/2010.
Hp:211.2@4200rpms/Tq.328.5@2700rpms
Best et: 13.959@97.05mph
Best mph: 98.3
Best 60' : 1.875 on BFG Comp TA's w/ 32 lbs of air in them
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Old 08-10-2007   #62
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GTA Year: 1991
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Re: Take a look at this hack job...

........and Darrell, the 69 Camaro Z28 is probably done the most.
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1991 GTA Trans Am
w/305,231 miles
on the original motor!!!!
Time of Death on motor, 4:07pm on 05/29/2010.
Hp:211.2@4200rpms/Tq.328.5@2700rpms
Best et: 13.959@97.05mph
Best mph: 98.3
Best 60' : 1.875 on BFG Comp TA's w/ 32 lbs of air in them
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Old 08-10-2007   #63
bill martin
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Re: Take a look at this hack job...

louvers i agree.. thank goodness for web sites like this one that people has put so much of their own time into to help inform people like you and i idenifiy a fake. but the way i see it is if a person is truley into buying a car for the collector value then they will do their home work. but their are those out their that purchase theses types of cars just to say" look at me i have a classic car" that is the type of people that are taken everyday.
so tonight when you and everyone else here at the source page goes out to the garage tucks in and gives your gta a kiss on the hood and tell it goodnight we can rest easy knowing that our 3000 poud mistress sitting out their is the real deal. and not some fake blond with bigger decals.
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Old 08-10-2007   #64
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Re: Take a look at this hack job...

That is true about the amount of clone cars and what it takes in order to identify them. That is the reason the person I spoke of who is selling their Cuda is having the problems.....because it is a clone of a more exotic make of Cuda. It is sad because it is in such mint conditions. If I was him, I would sell it piece by piece because that will be the only way to make the amount of money that he wants to make for it. If I sell my GTA some day, I will most likely sell it piece by the piece, because it seems that I can make more money to sell the new parts that are not on it and the new parts that are on it, and then the used parts that are discontinued. I would do this because the only thing that someone could use as an excuse against my GTA to pay a little is the amount of miles that it has on it, that is it though. Yumiko
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Old 08-10-2007   #65
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Re: Take a look at this hack job...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Louvers
Based on comments I am reading in this thread I would be afraid to buy any "collector" car or even "potential classic" without doing extensive research.

It's a good thing that there are organizations like this one:
http://www.ncrs.org/ to protect people that are looking for the real articles and not some home job done in someones back yard.

I mean come on ... get pissed off at me if you want but the talk about fooling someone into thinking a car is "true original" and how easy it would be to make money off of that just makes sick.
Can you honestly believe that a car that has been put back all original is not worth as much as a car that sits and has all the original parts replaced with the exact same pieces, taken to a reputable body shop, hours upon hours put into the body and it come out better than it was from the factory? Or taking the seats to an upholstery shop, correct seat covers put back on the seats and look as good as they did from the factory?

Having a car that was done properly, even if it was missing pieces, pieces were changed to something not original can make a car worth just as much as a "true original" which you will hardly find these days, especially in a 3rd gen car.

You need to ditch the "true original" comment because cars that are older than about 5 years old probably are hardly close to original anymore.

Clones are a different story, and I hate clones more than anything....that is a true effort to decieve someone into buying something that it truly isn't.
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Old 08-10-2007   #66
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GTA Year: 1991
GTA Engine: 350 TPI Automatic
Re: Take a look at this hack job...

Quote:
Originally Posted by gtayumiko
That is true about the amount of clone cars and what it takes in order to identify them. That is the reason the person I spoke of who is selling their Cuda is having the problems.....because it is a clone of a more exotic make of Cuda. It is sad because it is in such mint conditions. If I was him, I would sell it piece by piece because that will be the only way to make the amount of money that he wants to make for it. If I sell my GTA some day, I will most likely sell it piece by the piece, because it seems that I can make more money to sell the new parts that are not on it and the new parts that are on it, and then the used parts that are discontinued. I would do this because the only thing that someone could use as an excuse against my GTA to pay a little is the amount of miles that it has on it, that is it though. Yumiko
Yumiko, as good as your car looks, IMHO, I truly think you could get top dollar for it.
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Cliff Jones
1991 GTA Trans Am
w/305,231 miles
on the original motor!!!!
Time of Death on motor, 4:07pm on 05/29/2010.
Hp:211.2@4200rpms/Tq.328.5@2700rpms
Best et: 13.959@97.05mph
Best mph: 98.3
Best 60' : 1.875 on BFG Comp TA's w/ 32 lbs of air in them
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Old 08-10-2007   #67
Louvers
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Re: Take a look at this hack job...

Bill ..... I agree that this site is awesome and a priceless resource for all of us GTA owners. I know that I sleep very well at nights and if a bad dream should come along about my GTA it's only because of what the previous a-hole owner did wrong to it.

and now to......

Klortho ... in the year and a half that I have been a member on this site I have never once gotten into an argument with any other members here.... but you are off of your rocker man. I know a lot of collectors that are far more knowledgeable about cars and far more anal about their authenticity than I ever could be that would just scoff at almost everything that you have said. You and Jeremy want to pretend that you are being so nice and I am somehow being rude but you guys just don't have any facts to back up your comments. Yumiko can see the simple differences between these cars ... why can't you guys? You somehow want to kid yourself into thinking that a restored car or rebuilt car is the same as a "true original" and you are just nuts. Oh ... and yes, there are plenty of true original cars around and I happen to own one. I also happen to know other people that own several. How many examples do we have to give you??? How can I simplify my language so that you can understand my point any more clearly??? Yes, I am irritated with your comments and don't agree with you completely but you are not entirely wrong either. You are simply neglecting putting these cars in their proper classifications. NADA can do it and they are a major national company that specializes in the valuation of cars ... are they wrong and don't know what they are doing??? I don't think so! Are the folks at the NCRS a bunch of idiots wasting peoples time .... I don't think so! This thread was never about taking your car to Year 1 for a professional restoration and neither were your previous comments. They were about patching a car back together and passing it off as original and somehow claiming there's no difference and that's just mental.

At the end of the day I don't really give a crap whether you agree with me or not because as I said before, the numbers don't lie and it's pretty darn obvious to any who knows the differences about original cars, which car is the better choice. So my Corvette is worth 30k today ... in five years I estimate it to be at least 40k. When it hits 25 years of age and I can get 100k for it we will see who has the last laugh. Oh and by the way .... you can pick up a 40th Anniversary vette with over a 100 thousand miles for only around $10,000 but yet my car was appraised at $30,000 because it's "true original" and only has 5k on the odometer. If you have a similar situation with your car, maybe we can continue this little conversation that you seem to know everything about.
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Old 08-10-2007   #68
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Re: Take a look at this hack job...

Anyhow, it's time for ME to chime in and say that this thread has wandered off MY topic. Start a new thread or PMs...

Just was a ask for some quick help in helping decide whether or not an ebay ad was going to be a good choice to start on a project with my dad. Not a chance for everyone to come out and start talking about OTHER cars.

I appreciate all the information and witty banter that has been tossed around but I think that it's a "little" too far from my original post on the topic of the 92 convertible that was hacked up to look like a knight rider.

Thanks for everyone's input but the auction is over and someone else is the owner of the project car in question.
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Old 08-10-2007   #69
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Re: Take a look at this hack job...

Quote:
Originally Posted by merc3065
Anyhow, it's time for ME to chime in and say that this thread has wandered off MY topic. Start a new thread or PMs...

Just was a ask for some quick help in helping decide whether or not an ebay ad was going to be a good choice to start on a project with my dad. Not a chance for everyone to come out and start talking about OTHER cars.

I appreciate all the information and witty banter that has been tossed around but I think that it's a "little" too far from my original post on the topic of the 92 convertible that was hacked up to look like a knight rider.

Thanks for everyone's input but the auction is over and someone else is the owner of the project car in question.
Are you serious Merc? This site will have threads that get less then 10 responses or will sit for a week before someone chimes in. This thread has seen in excess of 65 posts in just a couple of days. The conversations also are directly related to your original post and it's fair to say that this wouldn't have gone as far as it did had it not been for the "hack job" comment that you started with. If Frankie has a problem with it, then I can gladly go elsewhere but I don't see any harm in hashing out our differences in a thread that was the root of the argument to begin with.

Also ... not that we did here but who hasn't hijacked a thread at the source page before? It's what we do around here

Darrell
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Old 08-10-2007   #70
MunsonGTA
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GTA Year: 1987
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Re: Take a look at this hack job...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Klortho
Clones are a different story, and I hate clones more than anything....that is a true effort to decieve someone into buying something that it truly isn't.
i'm only going to step into this crazy thread for a brief post. and it's to disagree with this quote above. many people clone cars because of what they want, not what they intend to do with it. I know many 3rd gen guys that go and turn an RS into a Z28, and it's pretty simple as to why. Because the RS car is easy to turn into a z28, which has better looks, better performance, and i personally feel is just a way better car. many of them have no intentions of doing it to decieve somebody. Another big reason, insurance... you pay alot less on an RS car then a z28 car. so why not get an RS, turn it into a z28 and have the car you want with much cheaper insurance? i'm not saying some people don't do it to try and get people to buy a car that it isn't, but the majority of people don't do it for the reason you stated.
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Old 08-10-2007   #71
JeremyT
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GTA Year: 1988
GTA Engine: 350 TPI Automatic
Re: Take a look at this hack job...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Louvers
You and Jeremy want to pretend that you are being so nice and I am somehow being rude but you guys just don't have any facts to back up your comments.
OK, Darrell, exactly where are your own facts? Once again, your attitude and personal attacks continue. How old are you, Darrell? You praise Yumko for her efforts in this thread, which I agree with.

YOU have not provided much facts, yourself, other than continue to resort to personal, snide, remarks, which shows your ability to hold the discussion in a mature manner.

For the umpteenth time, I've never said that this example of a car is worth just as much, or more, as an all original. You continue to put words in my mouth. You continue to expect me to do the homework and provide you with "facts" about comments that not only I didn't make, but you haven't done any yourself.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Louvers
Based on comments I am reading in this thread I would be afraid to buy any "collector" car or even "potential classic" without doing extensive research.

It's a good thing that there are organizations like this one: http://www.ncrs.org/ to protect people that are looking for the real articles and not some home job done in someones back yard.
Once again, it appears to me to be another cheap shot, as if there are people here who are in the field to "cheat" people. I am NOT one of them and I wouldn't want it in return. But aside from the front clip, I'm not sure how you can classify this as a non-original. You continue to forget how poor of paint quality these vehicles received, AND EVEN LOW MILEAGE examples CAN or MAY have some paint repair done at some point as a result of GM's known paint issues.

It's a "no brainier" that vehicle was a fair and decent deal, and will not be a "money pit" as you stated, because it's a rare vehicle, it's value will likely go higher than a standard TA or GTA hardtop. If you think the value of these cars are going up, or will go up, the convertibles will have a % more due to the lack of availability and due to the fact convertibles tend to have more value than their hardtop counterparts.
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Last edited by JeremyT; 08-10-2007 at 07:07 PM.
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Old 08-10-2007   #72
Louvers
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Re: Take a look at this hack job...

Wow! ..... I never thought that I would have this kind of experience on this site. Jeremy, I have read and participated in many posts with you in the past I have never had a problem with you. The same also applies to Klortho. I tried to let this go but you guys chose otherwise. If the examples that I have given already aren't facts enough for you then I don't know what else can be said. You see black and I see white ... that's just how it is. I am done with this pointless conversation. I don't know about you guys but I am having a cold one and putting this thread to bed.

vedali piu successivamente
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Old 08-10-2007   #73
Klortho
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Re: Take a look at this hack job...

Darrell, I ment no disrespect in my posts just a disagreement in what is considered "true original" to "put back original" and worth just as much with the same milage.

I agree, enough beating a dead horse.

However, you do have one sweet GTA though.
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Old 08-10-2007   #74
FearThisGTA
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GTA Year: 1991
GTA Engine: 350 TPI Automatic
Re: Take a look at this hack job...

Hey have ya'll noticed how gas prices have come down and the heat has gone up in the south? WHats up with that? and.... WHEW!! Man was it hot in Ga today at my house it got up to 104 degreezzzzzzzz!!!! Definitly gotta get that AC fixed tomorrow am!! As a round boy I can certainly say its not fun drivin around w/o A/C.
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Cliff Jones
1991 GTA Trans Am
w/305,231 miles
on the original motor!!!!
Time of Death on motor, 4:07pm on 05/29/2010.
Hp:211.2@4200rpms/Tq.328.5@2700rpms
Best et: 13.959@97.05mph
Best mph: 98.3
Best 60' : 1.875 on BFG Comp TA's w/ 32 lbs of air in them
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Old 08-10-2007   #75
FrankieRider2
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GTA Year: 1988
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Re: Take a look at this hack job...

I'm not going to take sides in the discussion, but I think we all just need to step back and agree to disagree about this topic.... no disrespect and no hard feelings.... and leave it at that.

I think everybody has said their peace.... or had the chance to. It's time to move on to other discussions.
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