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GTA DOCUMENTATION/RESEARCH Want to ask about your GTA's documentation, build codes, or other historical data? Then post it HERE!

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Old 08-01-2013   #1
87350gtanj
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Question 1987 gta convertible???

Hi, was just wondering if there was a factory (asc) convertible gta ever built in 1987 and if so what were production numbers
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Old 08-02-2013   #2
Gottabekidding
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Re: 1987 gta convertible???

There is a difference between a "factory convertible" and a "dealer optioned convertible"

Dealerships would get vehicles and send them out to ASC to be converted, then sold as new.
GM would assign an RPO code to have the vehicle sent out to ASC for conversion.
Since there is no central database of what dealership did what, you would have to rely on ASC's numbers.
I do not think their records separate GTA's or Trans Am's from the rest of the Firebird they converted.

There has only been 1 year that GM assigned a RPO code to a GTA to be converted.
In 1989 all Turbo Trans Am's were GTA's.
I believe that 1, 2 or 3 TTA's had the RPO code for conversion from GM.
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Old 08-03-2013   #3
87350gtanj
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Re: 1987 gta convertible???

Yes,I'M aware that first gen and four gen firebirds/trans -am's were the only GM factory build convertibles but didn't think there was a actual GTA convert to 88 or 89 from ASC and as far as i always knew late third year third gen's were ASC cars and the earlier 82-86 were done by a diffrent company or companies for that matter.
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Old 10-24-2016   #4
rarebmx
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Re: 1987 gta convertible???

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gottabekidding View Post
There is a difference between a "factory convertible" and a "dealer optioned convertible"

Dealerships would get vehicles and send them out to ASC to be converted, then sold as new.
GM would assign an RPO code to have the vehicle sent out to ASC for conversion.
Since there is no central database of what dealership did what, you would have to rely on ASC's numbers.
I do not think their records separate GTA's or Trans Am's from the rest of the Firebird they converted.

There has only been 1 year that GM assigned a RPO code to a GTA to be converted.
In 1989 all Turbo Trans Am's were GTA's.
I believe that 1, 2 or 3 TTA's had the RPO code for conversion from GM.
I've yet to see this "RPO" code for an 89 convertible. What is the "code" because I thought only cars with the 6th digit of the VIN as a 3 also received a code.
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Old 10-24-2016   #5
JonBlake
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Re: 1987 gta convertible???

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Originally Posted by rarebmx View Post
I've yet to see this "RPO" code for an 89 convertible. What is the "code" because I thought only cars with the 6th digit of the VIN as a 3 also received a code.
Not sure if there would be such a code, from what I've researched over a number of months, no verts came from Pontiac. From the best of my knowledge, vert orders were received from dealerships and cars were then sent off to some outside company (ASC or something like that) and they did the conversion there. I think there is a sticker in the door jam on the cars that had this done to them. I know there's many owners/enthusiasts out there on this forum that can provide the actual facts about it. But this is what I've gathered thus far in my research on these cars.
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Old 10-24-2016   #6
rarebmx
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Re: 1987 gta convertible???

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Originally Posted by JonBlake View Post
Not sure if there would be such a code, from what I've researched over a number of months, no verts came from Pontiac. From the best of my knowledge, vert orders were received from dealerships and cars were then sent off to some outside company (ASC or something like that) and they did the conversion there. I think there is a sticker in the door jam on the cars that had this done to them. I know there's many owners/enthusiasts out there on this forum that can provide the actual facts about it. But this is what I've gathered thus far in my research on these cars.
Well Pontiac made a convertible in 1991-1992 with the 6th digit of the VIN being a 3 (convertible) & an RPO code of Y81 as well as a CC1 code (ttops). However I've yet to see an 89 convertible off the Bird line with these codes. The Camaro lineup started this code sequence in 987.
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Old 10-27-2016   #7
TTOP350
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Re: 1987 gta convertible???

As said above, technically, GM never made a 3rdgen vert but when they were authorized through GM, a VIN digit was changed.
OKFOZ on thirdgen.org has the numbers and helped me document my one of 43ish, 89 Formula 350 ASC vert.
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Old 10-27-2016   #8
rarebmx
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Re: 1987 gta convertible???

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As said above, technically, GM never made a 3rdgen vert but when they were authorized through GM, a VIN digit was changed.
OKFOZ on thirdgen.org has the numbers and helped me document my one of 43ish, 89 Formula 350 ASC vert.
Technicallythe 89 Verts were made for GM but as a promotional car & all still carried the VIN 2 (6th digit) rather than a 3 however for 89 on tte Bird lineup people consider these a "factory" vert. I have an 87 IROC vert that also has the "2" in the VIN (6th digit) as well as an 89 IROC vert with a 3 for the 6th digit.
You will realize when you are trying to insure these VIN 2 cars that a lace like Hagerty has no way to verify them as anything but a coupe. I spoke to them last week regarding this exact situation.
I don't care about a 2 or 3 as the 6th digit. As long as ASC built the convertible that's all I need.
The 89 Bird lineup seems to be the only one recognized buy the Bird guys on the forums due to the fact there are records from ASC to document the order date, delivery dare, dealership & zone as well as last 6 of the VIN. OKFOZ has done a great job with the paperwork & I spent quite a bit of time reading these documents last week.
My 87 IROC was possibly one shipped off the lot to ASC but will not know anything until someone comes up with documentation. Instead of mine being a 6th digit VIN 3 car (available for 87 Camaro lineup) it is a VIN 2 car & carries a Special Edition badge of 103 on the dash. It is an ASC car though, so good enough for me.
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Old 10-28-2016   #9
JonBlake
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Re: 1987 gta convertible???

In regards to the 6th digit in the vin, I did a little research on this site and it is noted that the 2 represents a 2 door coup. I don't see any indication that there were any other numbers used for the 6th digit in the vin. Can you provide a link that states what a 3 for the 6th digit on one of these third gens would indicate? Maybe others on this forum can also elaborate a bit about this. From what I'm seeing so far, the 6th digit with a 2 indicates 2 door coup and nothing else or anything other. I think it would be safe to say that all third gens from the factory for consumers were only 2's on the 6th digit.
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Old 10-29-2016   #10
rarebmx
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Re: 1987 gta convertible???

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonBlake View Post
In regards to the 6th digit in the vin, I did a little research on this site and it is noted that the 2 represents a 2 door coup. I don't see any indication that there were any other numbers used for the 6th digit in the vin. Can you provide a link that states what a 3 for the 6th digit on one of these third gens would indicate? Maybe others on this forum can also elaborate a bit about this. From what I'm seeing so far, the 6th digit with a 2 indicates 2 door coup and nothing else or anything other. I think it would be safe to say that all third gens from the factory for consumers were only 2's on the 6th digit.
The 6th digit of the VIN starting in 87 could be a "3" denoting convertible started in 87 through 92 on the Camaro lineup. This meant the car was going to ASC for the conversion & was built on the line as a ttop (CC1 RPO CODE) for extra strength by GM. I own an 87, and a 89 IROC convertible. My 87 is a "2" VIN code because it was converted by ASC prior to signing the contract with ASC. My 89 is a VIN 3 code & was always slated to be a convertible & shows convertible on tge title, whereas my 87 shows a "coupe" on the title.
On the Bird lineup, the 6th digit on tge VIN never reflected a VIN 3 UNTIL 1991 & 1992.& do carry the the VIN 3 as well as CC1.
So in short:
1987-1992 Camaro lineup
1991 - 1992 Firebird lineup
To be a "factor"y convertible even though GM never produced a convertible in house.
Some say this is just Symantecs on ASC vs GM. In my eyes if ASC did the conversion no matter what the 6th digit says it's a factory conversion.
There is also documentation out there that the dealer network had ASC in place to drop ship cars to ASC for $4,990 to fulfill the convertible program in 1989 for the Firebird lineup.
Possibly someone else can explain better but unless the title says convertible the insurance companies don't see a convertible, they just see a couoe.
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Old 10-29-2016   #11
rarebmx
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Re: 1987 gta convertible???

*GM also never made a SSR convertible, that was ASC as well as the Sunbird, Toyota Celica & others. ASC was heavily involved with quite a few automakers until Fritz passed away. ASC expanded & expanded only to go bankrupt & sell subsidiaries off after Mr. Fritz passed away. There is little documentation of when ASC signed the contract with ASC (probably 2nd quarter of 87) for the Camaro lineup & I've personally spoken with some of the top executives when ASC was in its hayday who are still around but they just don't have recollection of time lines & numbers & no hard paperwork. Luckily Okfoz was able to get some solid documentation for the 1989 model year & that helps seal the 1989 model year as a program car on the Firebird lineup.
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Old 10-29-2016   #12
TTOP350
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Re: 1987 gta convertible???

I consider ASC as a factory authorized car even tho the "factory" never built em and as you said, good enough for me. All the other conversions look kinda hokey to me.

Same goes for the TTA and Firehawk programs.
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