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GTA NON-TECH Got a question about non-mechanical items related to your GTA.... whatever they may be? Then post it HERE!

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Old 10-22-2007   #21
gtayumiko
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

My GTA had those cracks also but after we repainted the entire car, they did not come back yet. That is the area where the roof metal and the sail panel metal are joined and the factory puts some body filler material there to cover the joint. And then if you drive on a surface and then up onto a surface that is very uneven compared to the surface that you are already on like a very steep driveway that is also at a severe angle, it will cause the car to flex and then you will get that crack. The crack happens in the body filler and paint, it is not the metal from what I recall. When we repainted my GTA, we also repaired the factory body filler in that area and so far it has not come back on my GTA yet. Yumiko
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Old 10-22-2007   #22
87bucketgta
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

Quote:
Originally Posted by gtayumiko
My GTA had those cracks also but after we repainted the entire car, they did not come back yet. That is the area where the roof metal and the sail panel metal are joined and the factory puts some body filler material there to cover the joint. And then if you drive on a surface and then up onto a surface that is very uneven compared to the surface that you are already on like a very steep driveway that is also at a severe angle, it will cause the car to flex and then you will get that crack. The crack happens in the body filler and paint, it is not the metal from what I recall. When we repainted my GTA, we also repaired the factory body filler in that area and so far it has not come back on my GTA yet. Yumiko
Hey I c u post on here all the time, u got any pics, u sound like u have a nice gta!!!
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Old 10-22-2007   #23
gtayumiko
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

I have a lot of photographs but I do not post them on here because I have to make them too small and it then does not look good. I did have my car on the spotlight and so if you look in that file you can see larger photographs. But I do not know how to find that spotlight after it has been removed. The only person in the entire world besides myself who has photographs of my GTA is Frankie. I sent him at least fifty or more. He may be able to post something from my photographs in a larger image then I can. But he was having severe computer problems then and I think he may have lost them all.

Anyways, Yumiko
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Last edited by gtayumiko; 10-22-2007 at 12:25 PM.
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Old 10-22-2007   #24
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

When Yumiko's car was on spotlight, I made sure I saved the whole pages, the thumbnails, and the bigger pics. I'm glad I did cos I cannot find it on here any more.
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Old 10-22-2007   #25
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

thought i was doing something wrong, I cant find it either
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Old 10-23-2007   #26
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

Quote:
Originally Posted by gtayumiko
I have a lot of photographs but I do not post them on here because I have to make them too small and it then does not look good. I did have my car on the spotlight and so if you look in that file you can see larger photographs. But I do not know how to find that spotlight after it has been removed. The only person in the entire world besides myself who has photographs of my GTA is Frankie. I sent him at least fifty or more. He may be able to post something from my photographs in a larger image then I can. But he was having severe computer problems then and I think he may have lost them all.

Anyways, Yumiko
You can just create an account on www.photobucket.com and then you can post big pictures on here. You just have to copy the IMG code and post it on the post you are doing. You upload the pics. from your computer to photobucket and then you just get the IMG code and post it. Its that easy. Please post some pics. Yumiko that would be awesome.
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Old 10-23-2007   #27
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GTA Year: 1988
GTA Engine: 350 TPI Automatic
Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

Quote:
Originally Posted by gtayumiko
The only person in the entire world besides myself who has photographs of my GTA is Frankie. I sent him at least fifty or more. He may be able to post something from my photographs in a larger image then I can. But he was having severe computer problems then and I think he may have lost them all.
Well, Yumiko, I am very appreciative if no one else has photos of your car. I have a bunch of them; they did not get lost. I'll try and post a couple in a separate forum topic for everyone....

Hopefully I'll be able to get started on that GTA Spotlight archive this fall/winter.
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Old 10-23-2007   #28
gtayumiko
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

Yes, this is the only site that I go on and talk about my GTA and GTA stuff. And you are the only one (in the United States) that I have sent photographs to in e-mail of my GTA. I have a friend of mine who wanted me to send many photographs to them in Japan so they could feature them in an article on American made sports cars. From what I understand, they were going to put them in a magazine article also. Yumiko

Some photographs that I posted before on this site:

http://www.gtasourcepage.com/forum/s...ad.php?t=49817
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Old 10-23-2007   #29
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

Yeah, I know how those stress cracks are caused, and it's just a flawed design. The cracks in the roof are into the metal, that is caused by the flexing action of the car. Like Yumiko said, they can be caused by hitting bumps, or hard angles, they can also be caused by cranking the motor up too high.

Generally if the car is driven hard you will be more likely to see these problems in the metal, and not in the body filler strip.

Mine has lead to some nasty rust build up on the inside underneath the seatbelt brackets, I've stopped it for now with a can of Krown.

So for sure keep me posted on how you go about fixing it. If it's just body filler and carry on, im going to get it welded. and go from there.
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Old 10-23-2007   #30
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

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Originally Posted by merc3065
Yeah, I know how those stress cracks are caused, and it's just a flawed design. The cracks in the roof are into the metal, that is caused by the flexing action of the car. Like Yumiko said, they can be caused by hitting bumps, or hard angles, they can also be caused by cranking the motor up too high.
Is this why they stopped the T-Top option on 350's after or during 1989?
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Old 10-23-2007   #31
gtayumiko
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

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Is this why they stopped the T-Top option on 350's after or during 1989?
I am not sure if they stopped the t top option on 350s after or during 1989. I know that they did not have that combination option (in the U.S. now that I see this months spot light feature) for 1987s. I have a hard top and it still had the cracks and my engine is only stock. So I would say it is safe to say anything that makes the body of the car flex either on angled surfaces or adding extra power, those cracks will happen regardless. Yumiko
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Old 10-24-2007   #32
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

Ouch. I also have the hardtop, on a stock 1990. It looks like my next purchase will be some Sub Frame Connectors...
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Old 10-24-2007   #33
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GTA Year: 1988
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

The 350/T-top restriction deal was due to weight and federal certification issues; it had nothing to do with body flex caused by the torque of the engine. Obviously for 1989, Pontiac changed something to get the cars in under the restriction.... what it was, I don't know.

I don't have a T-top GTA so forgive my ignorance, but wouldn't this cracking problem disappear if the car had T-tops because of the open roof? There would be no roof/sail panel joint. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong.
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Old 10-24-2007   #34
gtayumiko
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankieRider2
The 350/T-top restriction deal was due to weight and federal certification issues; it had nothing to do with body flex caused by the torque of the engine. Obviously for 1989, Pontiac changed something to get the cars in under the restriction.... what it was, I don't know.

I don't have a T-top GTA so forgive my ignorance, but wouldn't this cracking problem disappear if the car had T-tops because of the open roof? There would be no roof/sail panel joint. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong.
Yes Frankie, Even the t-top GTA has the roof/sail panel joint. Because the crease where the two panels meet run from the very top rear corner of each door jam and goes towards the back of the car all the way to near the area where the hatch back glass lid is bolted. The t-tops only take away the metal from the top of the roof and the area that cracks is still there on the car. The cracks seem to go backwards, meaning on the drivers side the crack goes in the direction towards the passenger rear tire and if this crack happens on the passenger side, that crack goes in the direction towards the drivers rear tire. But the cracks do not go that far. They just go anywhere from a mm to an inch at the most. Every Pontiac Firebird, Trans Am, Formula, GTA that I noticed to have these cracks (including my own before we repainted it) the cracks do not go for a long time. Just enough until it passes completely across the body filler. But one thing for sure, the cracks all start at the very same place, upper rear corner of the door jam where the roof and the sail panels connect.

Look at this months spotlight feature. In one of the photographs showing the drivers seat, part of the passenger seat and the rear seats, if you look at the top right corner of this photograph, it is in that area that gets the crack. Yumiko
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Last edited by gtayumiko; 10-24-2007 at 09:24 AM.
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Old 10-24-2007   #35
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

With the t-tops it's more likely to happen quicker because of the lack of reinforcement on the roof. That's also what contributes to the leaky/noisy t-roof is when the body flexes and starts to warp out of shape (and it will over time and use) the seals on the t-roof will not 100% seal.

Sub frames are an awesome upgrade to the car, but they can either be a real pain in the ass to install or easy, depends on the condition of the underbody and what style you get.

The subframes I bought for mine are the competition engineering ones, they were easy to install, but the exhaust has to be rerouted away from the stock locations. That makes it a pain in the ass to get the car back on the road.
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Old 10-24-2007   #36
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

From what I remember there are weldable and boltable ones. I wouldn't be interested in any that make me re-route the exhaust. It's hard enough getting standard parts in this country...

When you fitted the SFC's was there a dramatic change in the car, and if so, what changed and how?
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Old 10-24-2007   #37
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

Couldn't tell you how it's changed the car as i've never driven it yet.

For all I know they may need to be removed and welded in. I have the bolt in ones that i'll weld in when im positive the frame is straight.

But there are tons out there that you don't need to worry about exhaust routing. The reason mine was done like it was is because it's boxed 1/8" steel bars that run the length of the car, and bolt into the LCAs and the front subframe at the tranny crossmember. They add a good 50lbs to the car but they sure as hell are beefy
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Old 10-24-2007   #38
JeremyT
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GTA Year: 1988
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

I'm curious about T-tops being more prone to this crack. Granted the one T-Top car I have, has the 305TPI (1988), but I do not have that crack that the rest of my hardtop GTAs have. I've never had the T-top car fixed. It also has near 130K on it, which is plenty of miles to develop that crack, as evident that my hardtop GTAs with the crack have half that mileage.
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Old 10-25-2007   #39
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GTA Year: 1988
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

Jeremy, perhaps the effect of the entire roof solidifies that joint a bit? But then if your T-top car doesn't have it, who knows?

The crack I found on my red car is less than 1/8 inch long.... it's the smallest one I've ever seen. Hector has them on both sides, but I've never measured them.

I live in a rural area and on a gravel road; I don't drive very fast on it... 10 mph or less.... but the car does move around some even at slow speeds. No huge holes or bumps, but you know how "washboardy" gravel roads can sometimes be.
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Old 10-25-2007   #40
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Re: 1988 GTA Notchback

I don't have them on my 1990 hardtop, and I didn't have any on my 1989 T-Top. Both 350's, but like you say, it's probably NOT the motor torque that's causing it.
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