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GENERAL TECH (NON-GTA) Got a technical question or problem with your non-GTA vehicle but want the expertise of the GTA community? Post your non-GTA technical questions here!

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Old 08-13-2014   #1
djmarch
1989 Gunmetal Grey, 350 TPI, 700R4, 3:27 BW
 
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Virginia
Posts: 525



GTA Year: 1989
GTA Engine: 350 TPI Automatic
Fire, then no fire

Have a dilemma here and wondering if members have experienced such. Went to start the GTA last weekend as I do every weekend and it fired off at the first turn of the key, then nothing. Engine would turn over and over, but no fire. Funny thing is I would come back a half hour later and it would fire off again at the first turn of the key, and then nothing. It would crank and crank with no fire. Repeated this process all day, but no start. Things I checked.

1.) Fuel shoots out the schrader valve on fuel rail. I hear fuel pump when ignition is turned on.

2.) Checked for voltage at the coil with ignition switch on. Measured 13.6 volts.

Any suggestions out there will be greatly appreciated.
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Last edited by djmarch; 08-13-2014 at 03:22 PM.
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Old 08-13-2014   #2
rhomanski
The Born Loser
 
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Southside Batesville Arkansas
Posts: 396



GTA Year: 1988
GTA Engine: 350 TPI Automatic
Re: Fire, then no fire

If you have another battery, try switching them. I had one do that years ago on a different car. Also have seen a fuel filter collapsing internally and causing that. It would run for five minutes and then die. Wait 15 minutes and it would fire up like a brand new car. After that, maybe a relay, computer, the sock in the fuel tank? Coil, Distributor cap? I had a cap cracked years ago that would idle terribly until I went down the road a couple hundred feet and then it would smooth out and run perfect. How is the power? If it's down I would suspect ignition first. I might get closer with my guesses if I was there.
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Old 08-13-2014   #3
89-5.7GTA
Tony
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Rocky River Ohio
Posts: 301



GTA Year: 1989
GTA Engine: 350 TPI Automatic
Re: Fire, then no fire

I have never had this type of symptom.

It does not sound like a typical fuel pump problem. But, to be sure, I would check the fuel pressure at the rail with a gauge. Fuel squirting out of the schrader valve may not indicate whether there is enough pressure.

If you have good pressure at the rail, what about the regulator?

Can there be some glitch that is shutting down the injectors after the engine fires up?

What about the ignition module? I have never replaced mine and seem to remember reading that aftermarket modules are trouble-prone. Maybe?

But, I would so what you are doing: posting the question and seeing if anyone has a good suggestion! Good luck!
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Old 08-13-2014   #4
86TA355SR
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Re: Fire, then no fire

These kind of symptoms are difficult to diagnosis over the net...

After you check the normal stuff, take a look at the cap/rotor. IF heavily worn, they need replaced. Take a plug wire off a plug. Put an old spark plug in the boot and lay across a valve cover. Have someone crank the motor while you observe a dark blue spark. If there is not a spark, it's at the dist.

I chased an ignition issue one summer-it was a bad module. Had never saw one only break down during hard acceleration. Car ran fine the rest of time.

Your issue sounds like ignition to me.

Check fuel injector resistance on ALL injectors-cold. It's common the car will start when cold and won't stay running or won't start when hot. As the injectors get hot, the resistance increases to the point they won't 'fire' anymore, thus fuel starvation.

What fuel pressure are you showing on a gauge? what's the leak down rate?

When you get some more information, let us know what you found.
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Last edited by 86TA355SR; 08-13-2014 at 07:55 PM.
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Old 08-13-2014   #5
MunsonGTA
Bad luck or no luck
 
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Location: Ravenna, OH
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GTA Year: 1987
GTA Engine: Custom
Re: Fire, then no fire

I would pull the ignition control module out of the distributor and have it checked. My local Advance Auto was able to check mine.
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Old 08-14-2014   #6
djmarch
1989 Gunmetal Grey, 350 TPI, 700R4, 3:27 BW
 
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Virginia
Posts: 525



GTA Year: 1989
GTA Engine: 350 TPI Automatic
Re: Fire, then no fire

Thanks for everyones input. I will replace the ignition module this weekend as I have a spare. Which seems weird though as I get fire at first then not. Like something is shuting off after the intial crank such as a relay. Does anyone have a pdf file on which of the 3 relays cluster next to the master cylinder is the fuel ? as I don't remember. Maybe it's the spark control module mounted next to the master cylinder against the firewall is bad ? Anyone have a p/n on this ? Ahhh...the ----- of troubleshooting.
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Old 08-14-2014   #7
MunsonGTA
Bad luck or no luck
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
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GTA Year: 1987
GTA Engine: Custom
Re: Fire, then no fire

The fuel pump relay is the farthest to the left. The two on the right are the MAF relays. Does your car start up when you first try it and stay running? Or does it fire up, die, and then not restart?

My ignition control module went out 3 times. The symptom was always the same. My car would start up fine, drive fine, run fine. No matter how far I drove, after I shut it off it wouldn't restart. If I let it sit for severals hours or overnight, it would start right up again.
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87 GTA: Forged 408 LSX short block, TEA stage 2 cnc ported 243 heads, BTR Stage 3 stroker cam, Fast 102 intake, NW 102 TB, Longtube headers, custom 411 ECM, custom harness, custom tuned, Performabuilt stage 2 4l60E with PTC 2800 stall, 9 bolt rear with 3.70 gears and TAP girdle.

11.16 at 123 mph.

Last edited by MunsonGTA; 08-14-2014 at 09:40 PM.
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